sturla@molden.no> wrote:
> >
> > "David Cournapeau":
> >> Autotools only help for posix-like platforms. They are certainly a big
> >> hindrance on windows platform in general,
> >
> > That is why mingw has MSYS.
>
> I know of MSYS, but it is not very pleasant to use, if only because it
> is extremely slow. When I need to build things for windows, I much
> prefer cross compiling to using MSYS. I also think that cross
> compilation is more useful than native mingw build alone - there are
> patches for cross compilation, but I don't know their current status,
>
> cheers,
>
> David

My argument goes that one of the biggest differences between the
GNU/Linux and the Windows way of computing is the barrier between user
and programmer. In the Windows way, you are either a user or a
programmer. On Linux, just by the way you can download software and
run ./configure && �make && make install, you are encouraged to look at the
source code and by this you might in the not-so-long run start
reporting bugs to mailing lists and see that there are actually people
who might be able to sort out the bugs and that you might become one
of them.

The Windows way, you think those bugs are unavoidable and start making
jokes out of a feeling of frustration and helplessness.

That's where msys/mingw is supposed to come in, if only it was easier
to install, so that new Programmers don't get locked in in the
Microsoft compiler products and thereby the divide between the
software communities gets wider and wider.

Don't get me wrong, I think the python project is doing a great job in
terms of cross-platform portability, but things would be easier if
there was an easy combination of msys, mingw and autotools.

And by the way, I think the way the big linux distros like fedora and
mandrake distribute software is more similar to the windows way of
computing.

Gabriel


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Anyway Visual Studio, even with the Express Edition, is simpler and more productive for a Windows programmer.

You must suggest at least an equivalent "free" alternative to make the switch convenient.

Otherwise we are talking about philosophy or religion, and nobody will change his ideas.

Cesare
">

(original) (raw)

2010/8/12 �<linux@gabriel-striewe.de>�

On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 05:38:52PM +0900, David Cournapeau wrote:

> On Wed, Aug 11, 2010 at 10:21 PM, Sturla Molden <sturla@molden.no> wrote:

> >

> > "David Cournapeau":

> >> Autotools only help for posix-like platforms. They are certainly a big

> >> hindrance on windows platform in general,

> >

> > That is why mingw has MSYS.

>

> I know of MSYS, but it is not very pleasant to use, if only because it

> is extremely slow. When I need to build things for windows, I much

> prefer cross compiling to using MSYS. I also think that cross

> compilation is more useful than native mingw build alone - there are

> patches for cross compilation, but I don't know their current status,

>

> cheers,

>

> David



My argument goes that one of the biggest differences between the

GNU/Linux and the Windows way of computing is the barrier between user

and programmer. In the Windows way, you are either a user or a

programmer. On Linux, just by the way you can download software and

run ./configure && �make && make install, you are encouraged to look at the

source code and by this you might in the not-so-long run start

reporting bugs to mailing lists and see that there are actually people

who might be able to sort out the bugs and that you might become one

of them.



The Windows way, you think those bugs are unavoidable and start making

jokes out of a feeling of frustration and helplessness.



That's where msys/mingw is supposed to come in, if only it was easier

to install, so that new Programmers don't get locked in in the

Microsoft compiler products and thereby the divide between the

software communities gets wider and wider.



Don't get me wrong, I think the python project is doing a great job in

terms of cross-platform portability, but things would be easier if

there was an easy combination of msys, mingw and autotools.



And by the way, I think the way the big linux distros like fedora and

mandrake distribute software is more similar to the windows way of

computing.



Gabriel





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Anyway Visual Studio, even with the Express Edition, is simpler and more productive for a Windows programmer.

You must suggest at least an equivalent "free" alternative to make the switch convenient.

Otherwise we are talking about philosophy or religion, and nobody will change his ideas.

Cesare