[Python-3000] threading, part 2 --- + a bit of ctypes FFI worry (original) (raw)

Guido van Rossum guido at python.org
Tue Aug 15 05:01:57 CEST 2006

Perhaps this thread can be moved back to python-dev? I'm not sure how relevant a discussion of the ambiguities in ctypes' docs are for Py3k.

On 8/14/06, Tim Peters <tim.peters at gmail.com> wrote:

[Tim Peters] >> ... >> When the ctypes docs talk about passing and returning integers, they >> never explain what "integers" /means/, but it seems the docs >> implicitly have a 32-bit-only view of the world here. In reality >> "integer" seems to mean the native C int type.

[Thomas Heller] > 'ctypes.cint' and 'ctypes.clong' correspond to the C 'int' and 'long' types. Sure, that's clear. It's where the docs talk about (the unqualified) "integers", and the quotes there aren't just to scare you ;-). Like in: http://starship.python.net/crew/theller/ctypes/tutorial.html near the end of section "Calling functions": Python integers, strings and unicode strings are the only objects that can directly be used as parameters in these function calls. What does the word "integers" /mean/ there? > If you think that the docs could be clearer, please suggest changes. I can't, because I don't know what was intended. Python integers come in two flavors, int and long, so I assumed at first that the "Python integers" in the above probably meant "a Python (short) int" (which is a C long). But writing the thread test using that assumption failed on some 64-bit buildbots. After staring at the specific ways it failed, my next guess was that by "Python integers" the docs don't really mean Python integers at all, but C's int. That's what convinced me to /try/ wrapping the thread id in ctypes.clong(), and the test problems went away then, so I did too :-) I searched all the docs for the word "integers" and never found out what was intended. So you could search the docs for the same thing. Like, still in the tutorial, at the start of section "Return types": By default functions are assumed to return integers. Or in the reference docs: Note that all these functions are assumed to return integers, which is of course not always the truth, so you have to assign the correct restype attribute to use these functions. and the description of memmove(): memmove(dst, src, count) Same as the standard C memmove library function: copies count bytes from src to dst. dst and src must be integers or ... Python has at least three meanings for the word "integer" (short, long, & "either"), and C has at least 10 (signed & unsigned char, short, int, long, & long long), so the unqualifed "integer" is highly ambiguous. While in many contexts that doesn't much matter, in ctypes it does.

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-- --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/)

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