Robert (Robertian) de France (abt.0860-0923) (original) (raw)

Born about 0860 [location unknown]

Ancestors ancestors

Descendants descendants

Died 15 Jun 0923 at about age 63in Soissons, Francemap

Profile last modified 17 Feb 2024| Created 20 Feb 2012

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Contents

Biography

Name and Titles

860 Birth and Family

Robert was the younger son of Robert the Strong, count of Anjou, and the brother of Odo, or Eudes, who became king of the western Franks in 888. [2]

Robert's date and place of birth are unknown. Robert was the son of Robert "le Fort", who died in 866, marquis in Neustria, ca. 852-866. Both his older brother Eudes (Odo) and Robert (Ruotbertus) were children when their father died in 866. [1]

For the purpose of estimating Robert's birth year, assume that as a child he was aged 6 at his father's death in 866, thereby placing his birth year as, say, 860.

Baldwin states that Robert's mother is unknown. [1] Cawley, on the other hand, states that Robert was son of Robert "le Fort" Comte [de Tours], Marquis en Neustrie & his [second] wife. [3] Jim Bradbury's account of the Capetians states that his mother was Adelaide of Tours. [4]

884 Count in Lorraine

Robert is found in 884 as a count in Lorraine in the service of the emperor Charles the Fat.[1]

885 Seige of Paris

Robert was present at the Siege of Paris in 885. [2]

Appointed by Odo ruler of several counties, including the county of Paris, and abbot in commendam of many abbeys, Robert also secured the office of Dux Francorum, a military dignity of high importance. [2]

Robert did not claim the crown of West Francia when his brother died in 898; but recognising the supremacy of the Carolingian king, Charles the Simple, he was confirmed in his offices and possessions, after which he continued to defend northern Francia from the attacks of the Norsemen. [2]

888 Marquis en Neustrie

When Robert's elder brother Eudes became king of France in 888, Robert succeeded his brother as marquis of Neustria and other dignities, and he appears often at his brother's side in his charters .[1]

897 Marriage of Robert to Beatrice

Robert is frequently named as the husband of Béatrice of Vermandois, supposed daughter of Heribert I of Vermandois. Robert's supposed marriage to a daughter of Heribert is cited not only in the English Wikipedia [2] and French Wikipedia [5] but in Charles Cawley's Medieval Lands Database [3] A full discussion of the legend of Béatrice of Vermandois is presented on her profile.

Robert was indeed was married to Béatrice but she was not the daughter of Heribert. The parents of Béatrix [6] are unknown. Her falsely attributed fathers include Heribert I of Vermandois, and also Hugues, "duke of Burgundy".[6]

Her date and place of birth is unknown. [6]

The marriage date of 897 is estimated by Werner on the assumption that the marriage accompanied the political reconciliation between Beatrix's father and Robert's uncle. [3] This may be the source of Cawley's estimate of 898 as the birth year for Hughes, son of Robert and Beatrice.

Estimating based on the death of Béatrix before 907, and the marriage of her son Hughes to his first wife, say, 920, and the birth of Hughes himself, say, 900 with Béatrix aged 20 at the time her son was born, would place Béatrix' own birth at 880.

Beatrix is mentioned in an act of Hugues le Grand dated 26 March 931, in which Hughes' father Robert is specifically referred to as deceased, but Baldwin argues that Beatrix was deceased also by then.[1]

Other Marriage(s)

Sources agree that Robert had at least one wife other than Beatrix. If Robert was born about 860, there was certainly room in his life for a wife in the period before his marriage to Beatrix about 897 and after her death prior to 907.

Some sources name a wife Aelis as Robert's first wife. [7]

Two sources name a daughter of Aelis and Robert named Hildebrant of France, born 887, d. 931 of France who married Heribert II of Vermandois. [8] [7]

A daughter Emma, who died circa 13 Sep 935, is also attributed to Aelis and Robert. Emma married Rudolph, Duke of Burgundy. [9]

Wikitree (French) reports that the first wife went by both Aélis and Adèle du Maine and that by her, Robert had a daughter Adèle, who was married before 907 to Herbert II, comte de Vermandois[5]

Baldwin notes that Vajay has conjectured an earlier wife, Emma, daughter of Ludwig III, king of Bavaria but that there is no evidence that Ludwig ever had such a daughter, and the conjecture must be regarded as doubtful. [1]

Henry notes a probable additional spouse, Adèle, living 21 May 907. Adèle appears with Robert on 21 May 907, and has been placed as either a wife or daughter of Robert. [1]

898 Initial Support for Charles

After the death of his brother King Eudes in 898, Robert supported Charles III King of France who seems to have confirmed Robert's position in Neustrie. [3]

When Eudes died in 898, Robert recognized the Carolingian Charles the Simple as king of France. [1]

907 Death of Beatrix

On 21 May 907 a document named count Robert and, beside him, countess Adèle. [6] Interpreting this created two theories relative to Beatrix, whom one would have expected to be named: either Beatrix was an earlier wife who was married before 907 and had died by that time, or Beatrix was a later wife who married after 907. There has also been discussion as to whether countess Adèle was the name of Robert's wife in 907, or possibly his daughter. In any event, most sources agree that Beatrix was not alive in 907.

Baldwin joins the early marriage group, noting that Béatrix' date of death, while unknown, is probably before 21 May 907. Assuming that it is Adèle who is married to Robert on the date, then Béatrix would have died before that date. Her place of death is unknown. [6]

The legendary Béatrix is given a death date after an act of 26 March 931 by her son Hughes, which names both Hughes father Rotbertus and mother Beatricis, but appears to identify only Rotbertus as deceased. However, Baldwin notes, that if Béatrix were still alive in 931, then she would have been married to Robert during the time that he was king of France (922-3), and she should therefore in that case appear as regina in the 931 act, and not merely as domna. [6]

921 Rupture with Charles and Coronation

The peace between King Charles and his powerful vassal Robert was not seriously disturbed until about 921. The rule of Charles, and especially his partiality for a certain Hagano, had aroused some irritation. [2]

Supported by many of the clergy and by some of the most powerful of the Frankish nobles, Robert took up arms, drove Charles into Lorraine, and was himself crowned king of the Franks (rex Francorum) at Rheims on 29 June 922. [2]

In 922, Robert revolted against Charles, joined by his son Hugues and his son-in-law Raoul, duke of Burgundy, and in late June, he was chosen as king of France[1]

In 922 he rebelled against the king, triggered by the confiscation of the monastery of Chelles by King Charles from Rothilde (who was the mother-in-law of Robert's son Hugues) in favour of his favourite Haganon. [3]

922 King of France

He was elected Robert I King of France 22 Jun 922, consecrated at Reims by Gauthier Archbishop of Sens. [10]

Robert's coronation was 29 June 922, Rheims, and his reign was 29 June 922 - 15 June 923. [2]

Robert ruled as King of Western Francia (922 - 923). West Francia evolved over time into France; under Odo, the capital was fixed on Paris, a large step in that direction. His family is known as the Robertians. [2]

West Francia or the West Frankish Kingdom was a short-lived kingdom encompassing the lands of the western part of the Carolingian Empire that came under the undisputed control of Charlemagne's grandson, Charles the Bald, as a result of the Treaty of Verdun of 843. [2]

923 Death

Collecting an army, Charles marched against the usurper and, on 15 June 923, in a stubborn and sanguinary battle near Soissons, Robert was killed, according to one tradition in single combat with his rival. [2]

Robert's reign lasted slightly less than a year, for he fell at the Battle of Soissons on 15 June 923.[1][3][7] He fell near the abbey of Saint-Médard de Soissons.[1]

Issue

The only child with clear parentage is Hughes, the son of Robert and Beatrice.

Robert may have had other daughters. [2]

Richilda

Richilda, birth date unknown, daughter of Robert and possibly Beatrice. [2][5]

Emma

  1. Emma. Some sources say she was born in 894. One sources says she was the daughter of Robert and Beatrice. mariée vers 918 avec Raoul, duc de Bourgogne puis roi de France.[5]

Emma's birth year estimation: If she married in 911 at the age of 20, she was born in 891. If she married 919 at the age of 20, she was born in 899. Her mother would have been the wife who died in 907, if a wife died in 907. See Henry!

Flodoard names "Emma regis Rotberti filia" when recording that she obliged Seulf Archbishop of Reims to consecrate her as queen at Reims in 923 in the absence of her husband fighting. [3]

There is no indication which marriage Emma was born from.

Flodoard records the death of "Emma regina" at the end of his passage dated 934. She died 2 November 934. [3]

Emma married, in 911 or 919, Rodolphe (Raoul), Comte de Bourgogne, son of Richard “le Justicier” Duke of Burgundy & his wife Adélais d’Auxerre [Welf] (-Auxerre, Yonne 15/16 Jan 936, bur Abbaye de Sainte-Colombe de Sens). [3]

Emma died in 934. She married m. Raoul, d. 936, king of France, 923-936.[1]

Adela

  1. Adela or Adelle, was born before 898. Her birth date is estimated from the birth of her first child in [915]. [3]

The Chronicle of Alberic de Trois-Fontaines refers to "comitis Heriberti gener…Roberti" and in a later passage to the sister of "dux Hugo Cappatus" as the wife of "comitis Heriberti de Peroni, Campanie et Veromandie" but does not name her[ [3]

Her origin is confirmed by Flodoard naming "Hugo dux cum nepotibus suis, Heriberti filiis" in 943[3]

On 21 May 907, a countess Adèle appears in an act of the French king Charles the Simple, named along with a count Robert who is almost certainly the future king Robert I. As argued by Constance Bouchard, the most natural interpretation of this evidence would make Adèle a wife of Robert, but it has been argued that Adèle was actually the daughter of Robert I who married Heribert II of Vermandois. [6]Cawley deduces the name of this unnamed daughter of Robert and wife of Heribert II through the 21 May 907 donation of Rebais abbey to the church of Paris which refers to "comitis Rotberti et Adele comitisse". Cawley notes that although this phrasing usually indicates husband and wife, Settipani suggests that the chronology of the life of King Robert's son Hugues (attested as Robert's son by his second wife Beatrix) favours his birth, and therefore his father's second marriage, well before 907, which would mean "Adele" could not have been Robert's wife. [3] Cawley thus disagrees with Baldwin who deduces from the same donation that Beatrice was the first wife and already deceased, and that Adela was the second wife. Because the 907 donation itself does not provide the answer, Adela may have been the name of Robert's wife, or his daughter, or both.

Treating Adele as the daughter, Cawley has her married, before 21 May 907, to Heribert II, Comte de Vermandois, son of HERIBERT [I] Comte de Vermandois[-Carolingian] & his wife Lietgardis, and gives Adela's birth as 880 and death as 23 Feb 943, with burial in Saint Quentin). [3] It is clear that a daughter of Robert married Heribert II, count of Vermandois, but it is not clear that her name was Adele. Hugues the Grand was an "avunculus" -- maternal uncle -- of Heribert's sons, who in turn are called nepotes of Hugues. Some sources give this daughter of Robert the name Hildebrante [11] If Adèle was in fact the second wife of Robert, then there would be a reasonable case for making her the mother of Heribert's wife, since Heribert had a daughter named Adèle. [6]

Hughes

  1. Hughes son of Robert and Beatrice. Some sources give a birth date of August 24, 898. He was Hugh the Great, who was later dux Francorum and father of King Hugh Capet.[5][2]

Cawley says Hughes was born 898. He widely known as the son of Beatrix.

Béatrix and Robert were the parents of Hugues "le Grand", who died between 16 and 17 June, 956, duke of the Franks. Hughes married (1) an unknown daughter of Roger, count of Maine, by his wife Rothilde; (2) in 926, Eadhild, daughter of Eadweard (Edward) "the Elder", king of the West Saxons; and (3) 937, Hadwig, d. 9 January after 958, daughter of Heinrich I, king of Germany.[6]

Hughes, born 898, died in Dourdan, Essonne 16 Jun 956, and was buried in the église de l'Abbaye royale de Saint-Denis. The Historia Francorum Senonensis names "Hugo Magnus" as son of "Robertus princeps [et] sororem Herberti". He was installed as HUGUES "le Grand" Duc des Francs in 936. [3]

Hugues "le Grand", who died the 16th or 17th June 956, duke of the Franks; m. (1) NN, daughter of Roger, count of Maine, by his wife Rothilde; m. (2) 926, Eadhild, daughter of Eadweard (Edward) "the Elder", king of the West Saxons; m. (3) 937, Hadwig, d. 9 January after 958, daughter of Heinrich I, king of Germany.

Hughes appears on 31 March 914, in a charter of his father Robert, then abbot of Saint-Martin de Tours, in which he is stated to be his father's heir and he is called a son of Robert frequently by Flodoard

Conjectured Daughter: Adelaide

There is also a conjectured daughter, Adelaide, who married Ermengaud, count of Rouergue. Baldwin calls this relationship very doubtful. He notes that Vajay identifies Adélaïde, wife of count Ermengaud of Rouergue, with the countess Adèle who appears in 907, and makes her a daughter of Robert I [Vajay (1980), 773-776]. "This is pure speculation based on slim onomastic considerations (Ermengaud had a son named Hugues)." [1]

Sources

  1. ↑ 1.00 1.01 1.02 1.03 1.04 1.05 1.06 1.07 1.08 1.09 1.10 1.11 1.12 1.13 1.14 1.15 1.16 1.17 1.18 Stewart Baldwin. Robert I, The Henry Project. First uploaded 26 July 2008, revised 23 Feb 2009.http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/rober101.htm. Accessed May 23, 2017. jhd
  2. ↑ 2.00 2.01 2.02 2.03 2.04 2.05 2.06 2.07 2.08 2.09 2.10 2.11 2.12 2.13 Wikipedia. Robert I of France Accessed 1 May 2010.
  3. ↑ 3.00 3.01 3.02 3.03 3.04 3.05 3.06 3.07 3.08 3.09 3.10 3.11 3.12 3.13 3.14 Charles Cawley. Foundation for Medieval Genealogy. Medieval Lands Database. Capet Accessed May 19, 2017. jhd
  4. ↑ Jim Bradbury, The Capetians, Kings of France 987-1328, (London: Hambledon Continuum, 2007), 24. ISBN 978-1-85285-528-4. Cited at Wikipedia, Robert the Strong
  5. ↑ 5.0 5.1 5.2 5.3 5.4 Généalogie de Robert Ier sur le site Medieval Lands
  6. ↑ 6.0 6.1 6.2 6.3 6.4 6.5 6.6 6.7 6.8 Stewart Baldwin. Beatrix, The Henry Project. Baldwin notes, "This page owes much to several postings made by Peter Stewart on the topic of Béatrix on the internet newsgroup/mailing list soc.genealogy.medieval/GEN-MEDIEVAL." http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/beatr001.htm. Accessed May 23, 2017. jhd
  7. ↑ 7.0 7.1 7.2 The Annals of Flodoard of Reims, 916–966, eds & trans. Steven Fanning: Bernard S. Bachrach (New York; Ontario, Can: University of Toronto Press, 2011), pp 21, n.77, 92. Cited by Wikipedia. Robert I of France
  8. ↑ Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge, Band III Teilband 1 (Marburg, Germany: J. A. Stargardt, 1984), Tafel 49. Cited by Wikipedia. Robert I of France
  9. ↑ Wilhelm Karl, Prinz zu Isenburg's "Europäische Stammtafeln", Vol. II, Tafel 10, Cited by Wikipedia. Robert I of France
  10. ↑ Recorded by Flodoard and cited by Charles Cawley.
  11. ↑ Père Anselme, Histoire généalogique et chronologique de la maison royale de France, 9 vols. (Paris, 1726-33). 1: 68, cited by Baldwin

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