[Python-Dev] Import semantics (original) (raw)

Frank Wierzbicki fwierzbicki at gmail.com
Wed Jul 5 18:21:31 CEST 2006

On 7/5/06, Guido van Rossum <guido at python.org> wrote:

Hi Frank,

Have you and/or the Jython community made up your mind about this? The thread seems to have disappeared after you posted (or perhaps it continued only on jython-dev, which I don't read?). The thread pretty much stopped there. I think a modification of the import semantics won't really come up again until 2.3 is out, since releases and reviving Jython take priority over backwards incompatible features. For my part I would like to think that a goal for Jython should be:

Pure Python code developed first on Jython should run without change on CPython.

Which would mean we will eventually need to change the import semantics for importing Python code (though I doubt we will change the semantics for importing Java packages any time soon). Whether that can be done in 2.x, or if this change is so incompatible that we need to think about it in a "Jython 3000" way, I don't really know.

Also, I just realized that you're the new Jython maintainer. Is that official? It is official, at least in the unofficial way that Jython appears to work: Brian handed the baton to me after (I presume) Samuele Pedroni had handed the baton to Brian.

Brian's email is here: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=13859029

That said, I still regard Samuele Pedroni as the ultimate authority on Jython and give him pretty much full veto power. He fortunately continues to watch the checkins and prods me when I go in the wrong direction.

I'd like to offer you my congratulations, and, more importantly, any support you might need. Thanks!

I find Jython an important part for Python's long-term stategy. That's good to know.

I'm asked occasionally what the status of Jython is; people point out that the last release was 2.1 many years ago and the website has no news since early 2005; they're afraid that Jython is dying and that it's not a viable choice for new projects. I'm very happy to be able to tell them that soon there will be a 2.3 release and yes there is continued support... Perhaps for large values of "soon" -- but seriously, I am working hard to polish the coming release, make it easier for new developers to read the code, and when I have a chance, update the website. Jython is my first serious plunge into open source contributions (it is really too bad that I couldn't have been a journeyman for another year or so first, but circumstances did not allow that). I have suffered from some over-optimism when asked for release dates, so I'm really afraid to give too sharp of a definition for "soon". That said, I believe a 2.2 version will be out sometime this summer, and a 2.3 should follow relatively quickly (maybe 6 months or so)

The 2.2->2.3 will (hopefully) be relatively quick because 2.2 is an unfortunate but at this point unavoidable mix of 2.2 and 2.3 features, with heavy favoring of 2.3 features.

Jython has had a history of having a very small number of developers, and a history of too much off-list discussions so that new developers have a very hard time catching up. I'm trying hard to change that culture. There are 4 or 5 developers contributing patches lately -- so I'm actually spending more time trying to help them along instead of concentrating 100% on a release -- I really think they are the most important predictor of the future of Jython. I have high hopes for the project's future health.

Anyhow, this post is getting long, so to sum up:

Jython is alive, and we aren't going to let it die.

Regards,

-Frank

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