[Python-Dev] Backport troubles with mercurial (original) (raw)

Stephen J. Turnbull stephen at xemacs.org
Thu Dec 30 06:42:48 CET 2010

R. David Murray writes:

We merge bug fixes to 2.7 on a routine basis. It is the rule rather than the exception, by a long shot.

For bugfixes, of course it's routine. I understand that. My point was that the case Amaury fears, where the (new) VCS makes things harder than patching or porting by hand, is likely to be relatively uncommon, sandwiched between the "typo fixed in comment" conflicts (aka "trivial tweaks") and those that require reengineering.

Also, while workflow helpers will make a big difference to the non-VCS-geeks (ie, almost all Python developers), properly speaking this isn't really an issue with Mercurial, because all of the methods for this purpose are basically "diff | patch", although the executables are called things like "svn" and "python". They all demand workflow helper scripts to regulate the flow of desired and undesired patches. The difference is that the tool for hg is a SMOP, while that for svn is a SMOEP[1].

So, since we are going to be maintaining 2.7 for a while, this is a workflow problem that we must solve to make the hg transition worthwhile. I have no doubt that we will, but I also have no doubt we need to solve it, not just wave our hands.

Certainly. I think I already said that, no? My point is simply that while Amaury's expression of his requirements is welcome, and his experimenting with hg is extremely valuable, indeed a necessary part of the transition, everything he describes so far is a known problem that we basically know how to solve. He talks about changes to the workflow, but frankly, I don't see a need for that.[2]

IMO, changes to the workflow will be driven by kaizen, not by some brave new world revolution (Guido inter alia insisted on that) nor by thumb-in-dike disaster recovery (PEP 374 did a pretty good job on that, if I do say so myself).

I wish I had more time to do real work on this (not to mention email, thank you, David!), but it seems like every time I start programming, I fall asleep ... and six hours later, it's back to day job or family services. :-/

Footnotes: [1] Simpler Matter Of Existing Program.

[2] Aside for a need for establishing which hg commands correspond to which parts of the existing workflow, and perhaps creating helper scripts. Ie, I think the chances are pretty good that most people who have already tried hg are at least a little VCS-geeky, and probably they adjust personal workflow to the new VCS. That will not be so transparent to the "the tool should work for me, not vice-versa" majority.

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