[Python-Dev] Status regarding Old vs. Advanced String Formating (original) (raw)

INADA Naoki songofacandy at gmail.com
Sat Feb 25 11:44:35 CET 2012

I don't feel "similar to other language" is not enough reason for builtins violates the Zen.

Violating the Zen by standard library like getopt for compatibility to other language or API is good. So, I prefer moving %-style format from builtin str to function in string module in Python 4.

On Sat, Feb 25, 2012 at 7:20 PM, "Martin v. Löwis" <martin at v.loewis.de> wrote:

I find that strange, especially for an expert Python dev. I, a newbie, find it far friendlier (and easier for a new programmer to grasp). Maybe it's because I use it all the time, and you don't? That is most likely the case. You learn by practice. For that very reason, the claim "and easier for a new programmer to grasp" is difficult to prove. It was easier for you, since you started using it, and then kept using it. I don't recall any particular obstacles learning % formatting (even though I did for C, not for C++). Generalizing that it is easier is invalid: you just didn't try learning that instead first, and now you can't go back in a state where either are new to you. C++ is very similar here: they also introduced a new way of output (iostreams, and << overloading). I used that for a couple of years, primarily because people said that printf is "bad" and "not object- oriented". I then recognized that there is nothing wrong with printf per so, and would avoid std::cout in C++ these days, in favor of std::printf (yes, I know that it does have an issue with type safety). So I think we really should fight the impression that % formatting in Python is "bad", "deprecated", or "old-style". Having both may be considered a slight violation of the Zen, however, I would claim that neither formatting API are that obvious - AFAIR, the biggest hurdle in learning printf was to understand the notion of "placeholder", which I think is the reason why people are coming up with so many templating systems (templating isn't "obvious"). Regards, Martin

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-- INADA Naoki  <songofacandy at gmail.com>

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