[Python-Dev] IDLE in the stdlib (original) (raw)

Terry Reedy tjreedy at udel.edu
Thu Mar 21 07:42:33 CET 2013

On 3/20/2013 11:54 PM, Eli Bendersky wrote:

On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 8:32 PM, Terry Reedy <tjreedy at udel.edu

Ugly is subjective: by what standard and compared to what?

Compared to other existing Python IDEs and shells which are layered on top of modern GUI toolkits that are actively developed to keep with modern standards, unlike Tk which is frozen in the 1990s.

I think being frozen in the late 1990s is better than being frozen in the early 1980s, like Command Prompt is. In fact, I think we should 'deprecate' the Command Prompt interpreter as the standard interactive interpreter and finish polishing and de-glitching IDLE's Python Shell, which runs on top of the windowless version of CP with a true GUI. Then we can promote and present the latter as the preferred interface, which for many people, it already is.

There are 20 open issues with smtp(lib) in the title. It is 37 kb, making .54 issues per kb. For idlelib, with 786 kb, there are 104 issues, or .13 issues per kb, which is one fourth as many. I could claim that smtplib, based on 1990s RFCs is much worse maintained. It certainly could use somee positive attention.

Repeat: based on the 1990s RFCs, needing to be updated to the 2008 RFC, itself in the process of being superseded by a more unicode aware RFC.

You know better than I do that the number of open issues is not really the only factor for determining the quality of a module.

And you should notice that I did not present that as the only factor for what I said I could claim. Actually, I think the comparison would be fairer if enhancements were not counted. I am pretty sure this would favor IDLE even more (depending on what one counted as a bug).

Let me repeat this question.

What IDE might be a simple, install and go, alternative to IDLE that I might investigate, even if just as a source of ideas for IDLE?

It should have the following features or something close:

* One-key saves the file and runs it with the -i option (enter interactive mode after running the file) so one can enter additional statements interactively. * Syntax errors cause a message display; one click returns to the spot the error was detected. * Error tracebacks are displayed unmodified, without extra garbage or censorship. # Right click on a line like File "C:\Programs\Python33\lib_difflib.py", line 1759, ... and then left click on the goto popup to go to that line in that file, opening the file if necessary.

-- Terry Jan Reedy

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