[Python-Dev] PEP 453 (pip bootstrapping) ready for pronouncement? (original) (raw)

"Martin v. Löwis" martin at v.loewis.de
Mon Sep 30 13:50:51 CEST 2013

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Am 30.09.13 13:18, schrieb Donald Stufft:

Well the point we tried to get across in the PEP is that a normal feature you can typically just install a backport from PyPI to gain it early. This isin't so much driven by "well it'd be nice for the stdlib to have X", but "well this is a real and valid pain point that causes pain for a lot of users".

I see it exactly vice versa. A normal new language feature, you cannot get early from PyPI, e.g. if it's a syntax extension (e.g. the with statement). OTOH, this particular feature you can easily get from PyPI - just download and run the PIP installer.

The 2.7 backport was driven by just how painful this particular pain point can be. I've personally had feedback that in tutorials at like PyCon or meet ups that easily 1/3 of the time can be spent in getting users setup with Python, setuptools, and pip.

I'm sure there is something that can be done about it. What operating system are people using who have difficulties to set this all up?

I see that pip doesn't have a Windows installer on PyPI. That looks like the real culprit to me. I'd be willing to work with you to provide one (that ideally bundles all dependencies).

Obviously you're the delegate for this PEP and it's your final decision and either way If the PEP is accepted I'll do the implementation for 3.4.

The backporting is the main stumbling block. Otherwise, I'm in favor of the PEP.

Regards, Martin

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