[Python-Dev] Python 2.7 patch levels turning two digit (original) (raw)

Chris Kaynor ckaynor at zindagigames.com
Mon Jun 23 23:14:44 CEST 2014

Not being a Python developer, I normally just lurk on Py-Dev, but I figured I'd throw this out there for this thread:

Recent version of Maya embed Python 2.x, and the newer version of Maya (I believe 2012 was the first version) embeds a Python 2.7 compiled with VS 2010. From my experience, most C extensions work across compiler versions, however when they don't, it's generally a fairly difficult to debug issue - at least unless you know what to look for in the call stacks, and have access to the symbol files.

Chris

On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 2:07 PM, M.-A. Lemburg <mal at egenix.com> wrote:

On 23.06.2014 22:20, Donald Stufft wrote: > > On Jun 23, 2014, at 3:27 PM, M.-A. Lemburg <mal at egenix.com> wrote: > >> On 23.06.2014 18:09, Donald Stufft wrote: >>> >>> On Jun 23, 2014, at 2:09 AM, Martin v. Löwis <martin at v.loewis.de> wrote: >>> >>>>> >>>>> * Should we make use of the potential breakage with 2.7.10 >>>>> to introduce a new Windows compiler version for Python 2.7 ? >>>> >>>> Assuming it is a good idea to continue producing Windows binaries >>>> for 2.7, I think it would be a bad idea to switch compilers. It will >>>> cause severe breakage of 2.7 installations, much more problematic >>>> than switching to two-digit version numbers. >>> >>> I agree with this, we’ve just finally started getting things to the point where >>> it makes a lot of sense for binary distributions for Windows. Breaking all >>> of them on 2.7 would be very bad. > > Err, sorry that “We” was with my pip hat on. > >> >> Not sure what you mean. We've had binary wininst distributions >> for Windows for more than a decade, and egg and msi distributions >> for 8 years :-) > > Nonetheless, changing the compiler will not only break pip, but every > automated installer tool (easyinstall, buildout) that i’m aware of. The > blow back for binary installation is going to be huge I think. > >> But without access to the VS 2008 compiler that is needed to >> compile those extensions, it will become increasingly difficult >> for package authors to provide such binary packages, so we have to >> ask ourselves: >> >> What's worse: breaking old Windows binaries for Python 2.7 >> or not having updated and new Windows binaries for Python 2.7 >> at all in a few years ? > > At the risk of getting Guido to post his slide again, I still think the > solution to the old compiler is to just roll a 2.8 with minimal changes. > It could even be a good place to move to the ssl backport changes > too since they were the riskier set of changes in PEP466. > > But either way, if a compiler does change in a 2.7 release we’ll need > to update a lot of tooling to cope with that, so any plan to do that should > include that and a timeline for adoption of that.

Sure, and we'd need to hash out possible solutions to minimize breakage, but first we'll have to see whether we want to consider this step or not.

BTW: It's strange that I'm arguing for breaking things. I'm usually on the other side of such arguments :-) -- Marc-Andre Lemburg eGenix.com Professional Python Services directly from the Source >>> Python/Zope Consulting and Support ... http://www.egenix.com/ >>> mxODBC.Zope.Database.Adapter ... http://zope.egenix.com/ >>> mxODBC, mxDateTime, mxTextTools ... http://python.egenix.com/

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