[Python-Dev] Official citation for Python (original) (raw)

Chris Barker chris.barker at noaa.gov
Tue Sep 11 16:35:04 EDT 2018

On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 2:45 PM, Steven D'Aprano <steve at pearwood.info> wrote:

I think this thread is about academic citations.

yes, I assumed that as well, what in any of my posts made you think otherwise?

There's a metric ton of information on the web about citing software, there are existing standards, and I really think you are over-complicating this. See, for example:

https://www.software.ac.uk/how-cite-software http://www.citethisforme.com/cite/software https://openresearchsoftware.metajnl.com/about/#q12

The fact that those posts exist demonstrates that this is anything but a solved problem.

Its not our job to tell academics how to cite, they already have a

number of standardized templates that they use, but it is our job to tell them what information to fill into the template.

yes, of course -- I don't know why this thread got sidetracked into citation formats, that has nothing to do with it. Or as the op said, that's "the easy part"

Lets say one were to write an article about how different computer > languages express functional programming concepts -- you may want to cite > Python, but you are not trying to identify a specific version for > reproducible results.

I don't think we need to lose any sleep over how random bloggers and Redditors informally cite Python.

Why in the world would you think "article" meant random bloggers? In BiBTex, for instance, a paper in a peer reviewed journal is called an "article", as apposed to a book, or chapter, or inproceedings, or techreport, or.... As this whole thread is about academic citations, I assumed that...

I think the focus here is on academic

citations, which have rather precise and standard requirements.

not for software, yet.

No need to expand the scope of this problem to arbitrary mentions of Python.

I was not expanding it -- I was hoping to contract it -- or at least better define it.

Of course it is possible that I've completely misunderstood Jackie's request. If so, hopefully she will speak up soon.

I think we're all on the same page about that, actually.

My point, to be more pedantic about it, is that an academic paper might be about Python in some way, or it might describe work that used Python as a tool to accomplish some other understanding. These may require a different citation.

And a citation that satisfies academic criteria for using Python may not be enough to assure reproducible results.

And see Wes Turner's note -- it is highly unlikely that a single citation > to a standard document or something will be enough for reproducibility > anyway.

The academic community seems to think that it is. We don't have to tell them that they're wrong.

The Academic community has a really bad track record with reproducible results for computationally based research -- it is not a solved problem.

And it's not a "they" -- many of us on this list are part of the academic community.

-CHB

--

Christopher Barker, Ph.D. Oceanographer

Emergency Response Division NOAA/NOS/OR&R (206) 526-6959 voice 7600 Sand Point Way NE (206) 526-6329 fax Seattle, WA 98115 (206) 526-6317 main reception

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